March 2025 Housing Market Replace: Are Value Declines Coming?

Dave:
Your actual property shopping for window is open. Effectively, perhaps that’s proper. The housing market is softening after a number of years of supreme vendor energy. Potential worth declines could be a boon for actual property traders seeking to negotiate, however additionally they create danger for those who purchase on the flawed second. So which manner is the housing market heading and how will you take most benefit in your personal portfolio? In the present day I’m supplying you with my March, 2025 housing market replace. Hey everybody, it’s Dave head of Actual Property investing at BiggerPockets, and if you realize me, I imagine being a profitable investor is about studying and constantly enhancing in your expertise. Issues like deal discovering, tenant screening, managing rehabs, all that stuff is tremendous essential. However you additionally want to grasp the broad tendencies which can be taking place within the housing market as a way to optimize your portfolio to seek out the perfect offers and to keep away from any pointless ranges of danger.
Because of this, I like to supply a abstract of what’s going on within the housing market and I additionally like to supply my private evaluation and skim on the scenario. I’ll even inform you what I’m fascinated about and doing with my very own portfolio. That is for March, 2025. So tendencies could also be totally different for those who’re watching this a bit of bit additional into the longer term. Now I wish to simply say that I’ve been analyzing the housing marketplace for a really very long time. I’ve been an investor for 15 years. I’ve been working at BiggerPockets for 9 and proper now issues are altering just about as shortly as they ever have and that makes it extra essential than ever to grasp what’s taking place on your personal portfolio and reaching your monetary targets. Alright, so let’s discuss this softening market and what it really seems to be like within the numbers and naturally what it means to you.
Now for those who have a look at sure web sites like Redfin, you’ll see that dwelling costs are up 4% yr over yr in line with what information they’ve collected and after they seasonally modify it. Whenever you have a look at a number of the different information sources, there’s a supply known as the Case Schiller Index and that makes use of a special methodology the place it mainly tracks how the value of the identical dwelling change over time. And what you see whenever you have a look at the case Schiller is it’s a lot nearer to flat. And so we’re most likely in someplace in between these two. There’s no excellent measure, however we’re most likely flat-ish housing costs perhaps up a bit of bit relying on what market that you just’re taking a look at. So that’s certainly not any type of correction or crash at this level. It’s additionally probably not thrilling information by way of appreciation, however I believe the essential factor right here is that the development is simply actually flat or a bit of bit down.
We’re probably not seeing appreciation or worth progress begin to speed up once more. And so that is simply one of many causes I’m saying that the market’s flat. Now to grasp if this development goes to proceed or if we’re going to see the market reverse in some type of manner, we to dig in a bit of bit deeper, go one stage decrease to attempt to perceive why the market is considerably flat. And I at all times discuss this, however we now have to do it. We obtained to speak about provide and demand. That’s what dictates costs within the housing market. And so we have to see what’s occurring with provide, which is simply what number of houses are on the market at any given level or how many individuals are itemizing their houses. And we obtained to take a look at demand. How many individuals wish to purchase houses? Let’s begin with the provision aspect.
There’s actually good information about this. It’s a bit of bit simpler. So we’re going to speak first about one thing known as new listings. It is a measurement of how many individuals put their properties up on the market in any given month, and that’s up yr over yr. It’s up 6% in line with Redfin, which is sweet in some methods, nevertheless it’s not loopy, proper? We now have seen actually low stock and to return to a more healthy housing market, there must be extra properties listed on the market. And so having that go up, no less than within the quick time period is usually seen as a superb factor, however you need to look not at simply how many individuals are itemizing their properties on the market. You even have to take a look at how lengthy these properties are staying available on the market as a result of in the event that they’re getting listed and going shortly, then costs can preserve going up.
But when extra issues are getting listed this yr than final yr and so they’re simply sitting there and probably not promoting, then costs are most likely going to go flat or go down as a result of as property house owners who wish to promote their property are seeing their properties simply sit there available on the market week after week or month after month, they decrease their worth or they’re prepared to supply concessions. And that’s what in the end pushes costs down. And what’s taking place proper now could be that lively listings are up 10% yr over yr. And once more, that’s not loopy as a result of we now have to take a look at the historic context right here. So that you may know this, however again in 2019, lively listings had been averaging someplace round 2.3, 2.4 million. Then throughout the pandemic they went right down to 1.6. We really bottomed out at 1.1 million and though they’re going again up proper now, they’re nonetheless at 1.5 million, they’ll most likely go up over the summer season and get someplace near 1.9 million.
So that they’re going up, however they’re nonetheless not at pre pandemic ranges. And that’s one of many primary issues as we discuss in regards to the housing market that it’s essential bear in mind is after we evaluate what’s taking place now to what was taking place throughout the pandemic, it’s not the perfect comparability actually, as a result of what occurred throughout the pandemic was simply so uncommon. So to say, oh my god, stock has gone up in comparison with the pandemic. In fact it did as a result of it was like in any respect time lows. I personally like to take a look at that also, however in comparison with 2019, and so we’re seeing issues come again nearer to pre pandemic ranges, however we’re not there but. And so that is the explanation why I’m saying that the market is softening. It’s again to the place it was. I’d even say it’s simply type of a normalization of the market, however as a result of we’ve gotten used to this tremendous heated market that’s very tight, there will not be a whole lot of issues available on the market, there are nonetheless a whole lot of demand.
And so issues are transferring actually shortly. That’s why I’m saying it’s softening as a result of we’re simply transferring again to a extra balanced housing market. So that you positively see that within the lively listings numbers. You see that in another information that you would be able to have a look at for these items like days on market, these are going again up or months of provide. These are simply different methods to measure the housing market. We don’t must get into them at the moment, however what it is best to most likely know is that the entire measures of housing market well being are simply saying that we’re getting nearer again to pre pandemic ranges of the steadiness between provide and demand. Now in fact, what I’ve been speaking about to this point is in regards to the nationwide housing market, however there are enormous regional variations. We’re really seeing a whole lot of indicators that the market is type of splitting. Some markets are rising in a single path, others are going within the different path. So we’re going to interrupt down these regional variations in only a minute. However first we now have to take a fast break. And this week’s larger information is delivered to you by the Fundrise Flagship Fund, put money into personal market actual property with the Fundrise Flagship fund. Try fundrise.com/pockets to be taught extra.
Welcome again to the BiggerPockets podcast. We’re right here doing our March housing market replace. Earlier than the break, we talked about how a whole lot of the info means that the nationwide housing market is transferring to a extra balanced market, a extra purchaser’s market, however that isn’t taking place in all places within the nation. So let’s simply take a minute right here and discuss how stock modifications are totally different in several areas of the nation. First issues first, what it’s essential know is that each single state within the nation is experiencing will increase in stock besides North Dakota. North Dakota is down 2%, in all places else is up. That is simply yr over yr since 2024 in February to 2025 in February. And once more, I’m recording this in early March. So the final month that we now have information for is February. The state that has the very best shift in stock during the last yr is Nevada.
We see California at 44%, Arizona at 41%. Vermont is up there, Hawaii is close to 50%. In order that’s taking place in all places the place if you wish to know regionally the place issues are taking place within the least, it’s principally within the northeast and the Midwest. So I mentioned North Dakota, that’s type of an outlier, however New York for instance, solely up 3%. New jersey’s 9%, Illinois is 9%. So it’s type of a continuation of the tendencies the place the most popular or the strongest housing markets, I ought to say are within the Midwest and the Northeast. A number of the weaker ones are within the mountain west and west coast and the southeast as properly. Georgia’s up 37%, Florida’s up 34%. That’s simply at a state stage. However given what I used to be saying earlier than in regards to the utility and usefulness of evaluating information from this previous yr to the yr prior, it’s useful. We have to understand it as a result of it’s essential know the way the market’s altering.
However I additionally like to supply this context of how issues have modified since earlier than the pandemic as a result of that may actually give us some clues about the place costs are heading in any given market. And whenever you have a look at the info this fashion, it is rather, very totally different. Keep in mind I simply mentioned that all the pieces’s going up yr over yr as a result of it was tremendous low. However after we have a look at how February, 2025 compares to February, 2019, it’s a fairly totally different story. We now have sure markets the place we’re nonetheless nowhere even near the degrees of stock that we had been at in 2019. Once I have a look at a state like Pennsylvania, it’s down 50%, nonetheless over 2019. Maine is down 61%. New Hampshire, 61%, Illinois, 63%, nearly all of it’s concentrated within the Northeast and the Midwest. So Wisconsin, Michigan, Virginia, all of those states are actually down. Really Alaska’s down too.
That’s type of the one one which’s on the market apart from North Dakota. Once more, these are type of essentially the most considerably down, however even all through the remainder of the nation, most states are nonetheless down in comparison with pre pandemic ranges. If we have a look at the Carolinas, California, Nevada, Washington, Oregon, all of them are nonetheless down. So that’s type of the massive image factor that it is best to bear in mind is that though stock is returning, most states are nonetheless down in comparison with pre pandemic. So that they’re nonetheless not again to what can be thought-about a standard market. There are 4 states, nevertheless which can be above pre pandemic ranges. The primary with essentially the most stock progress above pre pandemic ranges is Texas. It’s 15% above the place it was in 2019. Then comes Florida with 9% above Colorado at 7%, and Tennessee really with 2% as properly. So once more, the regional variations actually matter, and I’m speaking about states.
I can’t get into each particular person metro space on the podcast, it’s simply an excessive amount of to do. However what my suggestion for all of you is to take a look at these two issues on your particular person market as a result of even inside Texas which has rising stock, there are particular markets and there are particular neighborhoods the place stock remains to be down. Or for those who have a look at Pennsylvania, which has 50% declines in stock, I’m certain there are nonetheless neighborhoods in areas the place stock is rising. So I actually suggest you have a look at two issues in your market. Go and evaluate stock ranges proper now in February of 2025 to the place it was final yr, see how a lot that’s rising after which evaluate it to 2019 and also you’ll get a way of how shortly the market is shifting from that actually robust sellers market. That was type of common for years again to what can be a extra regular type of steadiness type of market.
So what does this all imply? The stuff I mentioned and the analysis it is best to most likely be doing by yourself as properly. Any market the place stock goes up quickly has the most important probabilities of worth progress slowing. And in some markets that imply it would go from 10% appreciation to five% appreciation. In some markets which may imply six to 2. Some markets it would imply going from flat to damaging. And so it actually depends upon the dimensions of the stock modifications and what’s occurring in your explicit market. However as a complete, simply going again, zooming again out to the nationwide stage, I do suppose that given stock is rising and demand hasn’t picked again up, no less than within the final couple of months, we’re going to see additional softening. And that is a kind of the explanation why I’ve mentioned repeatedly that I do suppose costs might be perhaps modestly up this yr or someplace close to flat, particularly whenever you evaluate these issues to inflation, they may be a bit of bit damaging based mostly on the info that we’re seeing right here at the moment.
Now once more, that isn’t going to occur in each market and what which means for actual property traders just isn’t as apparent as you suppose. Declining costs will not be essentially a nasty factor. Lots of people, I’d say perhaps even most traders suppose that’s really a superb factor. So we’ll discuss extra about what a softening market means, however we type of have to deal with one different large factor earlier than we get into what it is best to do subsequent, which is in fact mortgage charges. Mortgage charges have been within the information lots and as of this recording, they’ve dropped down to six.64% for a 30 yr repair, which is down almost 0.6% from the place they had been. That they had shot up all the best way to 7.25%. They’ve come down lots and that’s usually excellent news for actual property traders. However in fact the explanation that is taking place is as a result of there may be dangerous financial information.
So we now have to dig into this a bit of bit and type of unpack what’s taking place and what this implies. So why have charges fallen a lot during the last couple of weeks? We’ve talked about this in different episodes, you’ll be able to go hear about it in additional element, however we’ve seen a bunch of sentimental financial information. The very first thing was we had low client sentiment. We really had the most important month over month drop in 4 years. It’s not like that is going loopy, it’s decrease than it was over the previous couple of months, nevertheless it’s just about consistent with the place it’s been from 2022 to 2025. However after the election, client confidence had been rising and that has reversed itself during the last couple of weeks, and that decline in client confidence worries traders. And so we’ve seen some weak point within the gentle market. I’ll get to that in a second.
The opposite factor that we’ve seen is an uptick in unemployment claims. There are many methods to measure unemployment. That is one I prefer to measure as a result of it mainly seems to be on the variety of layoffs. And so we’ve seen layoffs begin to tick up. Once more, nothing loopy, however these are simply small issues that begin to spook the market, proper? And what we’re speaking about after we discuss mortgage charges is actually how bond traders and inventory traders are reacting to all this information. And proper now, given the extent of uncertainty on the earth, given the extent of uncertainty within the markets, individuals are very delicate. They’re reacting fairly dramatically forwards and backwards to all of the information that they’re getting. And so little modifications in unemployment claims, little modifications in client sentiment are most likely impacting markets greater than they might if this was 10 years in the past in the midst of only a regular financial cycle.
So that’s two issues which can be taking place. And so there’s really one factor that has occurred during the last simply two weeks that I believe has additional spooked traders, not tariffs. These are type of apparent. That’s positively one thing that’s been weighing on individuals’s thoughts. However one thing that I believe obtained misplaced within the shuffle over the previous couple of weeks is that there’s this device known as the GDP Now device. It’s put out by the Atlanta Fed, and it mainly predicts the place gross home product goes to go for the present quarter that we’re in. For those who don’t know what GDP is gross home product, it’s mainly the entire measurement of financial output and it’s tremendous essential, proper? If the economic system is rising, that’s usually a superb factor for the USA. If the economic system contracts, which means individuals’s high quality of life spending energy is usually taking place.
And anyway, what occurred was the Atlanta Fed device, which has confirmed to be very correct traditionally, has modified its prediction. Simply two weeks in the past it was predicting 2% progress for GDP, which isn’t nice. It’s not like a tremendous quarter, nevertheless it’s not dangerous. It’s type of identical to a standard type of quarter. It mainly plummeted and the estimate now went to about damaging 2.5% and has held there for 3 consecutive weeks. And so now they’re predicting that GDP is definitely going to say no right here within the first quarter of 2025, and that’s tremendous vital for all the explanations that I simply talked about. So between softer client sentiment and uptick in unemployment claims, softer GDP projections, uncertainty round tariffs, this has simply mainly spooked traders and it has led to a big inventory market selloff. We’ve seen the NASDAQ was down 10% at sure factors, which is correction territory.
That’s a big decline. We’re mainly seeing the complete enhance within the inventory market that we noticed after the Trump election erased we’re again to mainly the place we had been earlier than the election. And what occurs for actual property traders for mortgages is when individuals dump their inventory market, sometimes what they do is that they take their cash and so they put it in bonds. And I’m not speaking about me. If I bought off a few of my inventory, I most likely wouldn’t go do that, however we’re speaking in regards to the large cash movers. Individuals who handle pension plans or hedge funds, they should put that cash someplace. And so after they take it out of inventory market, they sometimes put it into bonds as a result of they’re seen as protected after they’re spooked about what’s taking place within the inventory market or the economic system as a complete, they take the cash, they put it in bonds, and that will increase demand for bonds as a result of everybody needs them.
And that pushes down yields, proper? If lots of people wish to lend cash to the federal government, the federal government can borrow that cash at a decrease rates of interest. That’s yields coming down. And since yields and mortgage charges are nearly completely correlated, that may take mortgage charges down with them. And so that’s the reason mortgage charges have come down. In fact, nobody is aware of for certain what’s going to occur, however I’ll provide you with no less than my opinion and what I’m fascinated about and doing with my very own portfolio. However first, we now have to take a fast break. We’ll be proper again. For those who’re wanting to get began in actual property investing, a wise first step is to accomplice with an investor pleasant monetary planner who might help you get your own home so as and make sure you’re arrange for monetary success from the get go to biggerpockets.com/tax finder to get matched with a tax skilled or monetary planner in your space.
Welcome again to the BiggerPockets podcast. We’re right here doing our March housing market replace and the place we left off, I used to be going to attempt to make sense of this entire scenario and share with you what I believe this all means. Now, all the info, all the pieces that I’ve shared with you, the longer term and path of the housing market to me is absolutely about financial sentiment. And that mainly simply sucks as a result of it’s onerous to foretell, proper? I’m sorry, however I do know different influencers, creators, they’re going to inform you definitively what’s going to occur, however they’re deceptive. I’m an analyst and the one factor I can inform you with certainty is that proper now issues are significantly unsure and that’s crucial factor to recollect. It’s okay on your investing thesis or speculation to be that it’s unsure. It’s higher to confess that than to behave on a false interpretation or false certainty since you don’t actually know.
However right here’s how I’m personally seeing this. It appears to me that financial pessimism is gaining steam and other people may have totally different opinions about what’s going to occur sooner or later. I’m taking a look at information, I’m taking a look at tendencies, and that is what the info exhibits. It exhibits that investor confidence is down, the inventory market is popping, the housing market is beginning to soften, and does that imply we’re going to a recession? I don’t know. I believe it’s far too early to say that the GDP now factor is only one estimate, however I’m simply telling you that the change from the place we had been in January to the place the info was in February is fairly vital. There was a whole lot of financial optimism in December and January that has shifted in February and it would shift again, however proper now it does really feel like financial pessimism is gaining steam.
And for me, there are a pair issues to remove from this. The very first thing that has been coming to my thoughts lately is that if we enter in a recession, and once more, that may be a large if, however one thing I’ve been fascinated about is might this form as much as be what’s kind a traditional financial cycle the place actual property is the quote first in first out, for those who haven’t heard of this, there’s this sample that has existed in a whole lot of recessions prior to now the place issues are going off nice, we’re in an growth, companies are booming, the inventory market’s going up, all the pieces is nice, individuals are taking out debt. At a sure level, the economic system begins to overheat and that results in inflation. At that time, the Federal Reserve raises rates of interest, proper? Sound acquainted? That is what’s been occurring. And when the Federal Reserve raises rates of interest, it impacts actual property first.
And I’m not saying this simply because it is a actual property podcast, however actual property is simply mainly essentially the most leveraged asset class. And truly as we’ve seen during the last a number of many years, it’s develop into actually type of by itself in how leveraged it’s, which mainly means it makes use of essentially the most debt. And certain individuals take out debt to finance buildings and manufacturing and expansions for companies, however actual property is absolutely extremely leveraged. And so that you see actual property bear the brunt of a recession really at the start else. And for those who’re on this trade, you’ve been most likely saying this and screaming that we’re in an actual property recession for the final two or three years, transaction quantity has been down, costs have been largely flat, proper? We’ve type of been in an actual property recession for some time. However what’s been superb is that different components of the American economic system has remained resilient regardless of these increased rates of interest.
And for one cause or one other, perhaps that resilience is cracking proper now and it’s reverting again to what we’d’ve anticipated that the remainder of the economic system is beginning to really feel a number of the ache of upper rates of interest. In order that’s type of the traditional begin of a recession, proper? Actual property comes first after which the remainder of the economic system comes second. However then what occurs when the remainder of the economic system begins to decelerate? Effectively, the Federal Reserve needs to stimulate the economic system. They’re now not as afraid of inflation, in order that they decrease rates of interest, and that provides a stimulus first to actual property, proper? As a result of it’s a leveraged asset class. In order these charges begin to come down, it kickstarts financial exercise, significantly in the actual property part, and that may really assist lead the complete economic system out of a recession. And actual property is large enough.
It’s a large enough a part of our economic system to each assist deliver the economic system right into a recession. And out of it, it’s estimated to be about 16% of GDP. That’s enormous for anyone trade. Now, for those who’re pondering that’s not what occurred in 2008, that’s positively true. It’s type of the exception to this sample, and we don’t know what’s going to occur. However the perception amongst most economists is it didn’t occur in 2008 as a result of not like this present time in 2008, housing was the issue. That’s what created the recession within the first place. Whereas proper now, housing just isn’t the issue. Housing, a whole lot of the basics are essentially sound. What’s occurring with housing is known as a response to rates of interest. And so what I see rising is probably this primary in first out scenario. That’s most likely what I believe is the most certainly state of affairs as we’re taking a look at it at the moment.
I believe there are two different issues which can be attainable that I’ll simply point out, however I believe they’re much less seemingly. So the second factor that may occur is perhaps that is only a blip in financial information and there’s really going to be robust progress and other people regain their confidence, during which case we’ll most likely see mortgage charges return up a bit of bit. I don’t know in the event that they’re going to return as much as 7.25, however they’ll most likely return up once more. By which case, I believe the housing market will proceed on its present softening trajectory. Once more, I don’t suppose which means a crash. It most likely means corrections in sure markets the place different markets are going to continue to grow. However I believe we’ll proceed on the development that we’ve been on for the final couple of months. So that may be a second risk. It’s not that unlikely, it simply doesn’t appear to be the most certainly state of affairs.
After which the third one, I don’t suppose that is so seemingly proper now, however really whenever you have a look at a number of the information, there’s a little little bit of danger proper now of what’s often called stagflation. And once more, I don’t suppose that is what’s taking place simply but, however I simply wish to name it out as a result of it’s attainable. Stagflation is when the economic system slows down, however inflation goes up. That is mainly the worst case state of affairs for the economic system, however we now have seen inflation go up a bit of bit then it’s type of flat, so it’s not tremendous regarding simply but. However there’s a world the place inflation goes again up as a consequence of tariffs. And the GDP now device is appropriate and GDP declines, during which case we’d have a very tough financial scenario the place the economic system is contracting, however inflation goes up, and that’s mainly the worst case state of affairs.
Spending energy goes down, however wages aren’t going up, the inventory market goes down. And so though that’s attainable, I wouldn’t fear about that simply but. It’s simply one thing that I wished to say that we’ll control within the subsequent couple of months. In order we do these updates each single month, I’ll replace you and allow you to know if that’s a priority. There’s some information tendencies that recommend it’s attainable, however I believe we’re nonetheless a far manner off from concluding that that’s taking place. So let’s simply return to what I believe is the most certainly state of affairs, which is type of this primary in first out scenario with actual property. Does that imply that it’s probably a superb time to purchase actual property, proper? As a result of don’t get me flawed, when markets are softening like they’re, that comes with danger.
There’s additional danger that costs are going to say no. And I’ve mentioned it earlier than, however there may be a whole lot of rubbish on the market. There’s a whole lot of dangerous offers, overpriced stuff on the market, and issues might worsen earlier than they get higher. However there may be additionally a case that in no less than some and perhaps many regional markets {that a} shopping for window might emerge. Take into consideration the situations that we would have over the following couple of months. Extra stock coming available on the market results in worth softness, which provides you negotiating leverage, proper? As a result of if you realize that costs are gentle and so they may be declining extra, that’s one thing that you have to be utilizing in your bid technique. And whenever you’re providing on properties, attempt to purchase under asking worth or what you suppose the market may backside out at. So that provides you negotiating leverage. Keep in mind I mentioned softening it sounds scary, however that really means we’re in a purchaser’s market.
Consumers have the facility. In order that’s one good factor you may not wish to purchase even in a purchaser’s market, for those who suppose that that purchaser’ss market’s going to proceed for a very long time and we’re going to have this type of protracted interval of costs taking place. However do not forget that costs have been largely flat or rising modestly over simply the final couple of years. And so we’ve seen this for some time. And if the present financial temper is appropriate and that we’re going to see a contracting economic system, that implies that charges may keep as little as they’re now and so they might go down a bit of bit extra. And if that state of affairs occurs, that would deliver demand again into the housing market. Individuals usually suppose that if the economic system is doing poorly and there’s a recession that causes decrease housing demand, however that isn’t at all times the case.
Housing demand is nearly at all times tied to affordability. And so sure, for those who don’t have a job, you’re not going to be going on the market and shopping for a house. However for individuals who really feel safe of their jobs, this may really result in higher housing affordability. If the market softens and charges go down, which means extra individuals are going to have the ability to afford extra houses. That drives up demand and will really reignite worth appreciation within the housing market. That’s not what occurred in 2008, bear in mind, that’s an outlier. However that is what usually occurs. So it’s one thing I’ll be retaining an in depth eye out for, and I like to recommend you do too. Personally, I’ve been on the lookout for offers. I’m at all times on the lookout for offers. I haven’t discovered something to this point but this yr. I’ve provided on some, haven’t been in a position to make it work, however I’m perhaps surprisingly optimistic in regards to the potential for deal circulate over the following couple of months and within the second half of this yr.
I believe that proper now, we’ve been speaking lots this yr about this potential for upside. And whereas there may be danger, don’t get me flawed, there may be danger in these sorts of markets. That upside is there and may even really be rising all through 2025 as a result of if charges do come down and you’ve got the chance to barter higher costs on homes, that would set the stage for actually good upside and future progress. In order that’s how I’m seeing it. I’d love for those who’re watching this on YouTube to tell us how you might be deciphering this housing market and what choices you’re making about your personal portfolio. Thanks all a lot for listening to this episode of the BiggerPockets podcast. I hope this housing market replace was helpful to you. We’ll see you subsequent time.